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[00:00:05] Henry Emmons, MD: Hello, I'm Henry Emmons and welcome back to Joy Lab.
[00:00:09] Aimee Prasek, PhD: And I am Aimee Prasek. We are in our Element of Resilience, our resilience training, and for this aspect of Resilience, we are focusing on cultivating a good heart.
[00:00:23] Henry Emmons, MD: My favorite topic. Hahaha.
[00:00:24] Aimee Prasek, PhD: I — yep. Yep. If you've been with us before, you know Henry loves this stuff. And you probably know that we find it essential when working with mental health, when talking about mental health, when practicing. But this is not a common conversation in mental health. Uh, would you agree, Henry? You don't get this at psychiatric conferences.
[00:00:49] Henry Emmons, MD: I would agree. Yes.
[00:00:50] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Yeah. Most of our attention in mental health gets stuck in the brain, like mental health only exists right here in our heads and we only need to care for our head when something goes wrong. But the science is so clear here, that mental health is way more than just an imbalance of neurochemicals bouncing around our brain.
[00:01:12] Henry Emmons, MD: Well, ironically — it seems ironic now — when I chose to go into psychiatry, I kind of thought this is what we would be doing.
[00:01:20] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Hahaha. Oh man. You did not know what was coming, did you?
[00:01:23] Henry Emmons, MD: I was pretty bummed out when I realized. It's not even — yeah, not even in the conversation. But I mean, the good thing is I also find the harder sciences, the neuroscience and human physiology, to be really interesting. It's just not enough.
You know, I think this is really what drew me to the work of Jon Kabat-Zinn — the mindfulness work, early in my career — I think I was just two or three years in when I came across his work. And I remember very clearly when I did my training with him that he talked about doing this, some practice like this, like mindfulness. The goal, if there's a goal, is to build a larger container. And I think what he meant by that was to have a lot more to draw from to dilute the suffering and the challenges of life that we all have, by being able to pull from a larger container, if you will. That just made so much sense to me and it continues to be a big inspiration for me, all these years later.
So, you know, the metaphor that we used earlier in this Resilience Series is of the water cooler, which we all kind of walk around with in our brains that contains this magic elixir of resilience. And we have a lot of things we can do, a lot of things in our power, to keep refilling that container, to — through all the good self-care and so forth. And also to find ways to try to stem the the draining out of it by, you know, dealing with the things in our lives that are sucking us dry. And we can do all of that, you know, and we should. I mean, taking good care of ourselves, both physically and emotionally, and trying to deal with the stresses and challenges in our lives. That's all really, really important. And still, it's not always enough, right? Most of us, at one point in our lives or another, are gonna find that out. Plus, it's a lot of work to keep focusing really diligently on self-care all the time. It's just a lot of work. So this topic of cultivating a good heart is what I think really moves us into that conversation of creating a larger container. We are so much more than our brain chemistry or our bodies. We're even more than our thoughts and emotions.
We are built for connection, I think, and that's what I believe really enlarges our container. It's this ability to stay open, to keep ourselves open, and connecting with things — people, and things beyond ourselves. So we're gonna get into that a little more in our next episode when we really focus on connection. But it's something we try to do throughout Joy Lab. You know, how do we create these deep, wide, genuine connections? What is the part of us that allows us to do that? Well, I think It's through the heart. I think of the heart as the organ of connection. So to me, what cultivating a good heart means is that it's the way to create more openness — to do it in a way that's easy and natural for us to connect with the people and the things that really matter most to us.
[00:05:32] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Easy and natural. I just wanna like, spend some time in that space. I had a friend who sent me a — it's like a morning routines thing on Instagram or TikTok or something. And she asked me, is this accurate? It was for mental health, like a morning routine to help your mental health. And it started at like 4:30 in the morning and it ended at like 6:50 and it was, no joke, like 14 steps of complex products, and powders, and practices and, I don't know. All of these things. I was exhausted after.
[00:06:19] Henry Emmons, MD: Sounds a little like a longevity thing.
[00:06:21] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Oh, yep. Oh yeah, I sent it back. I'm like, "I don't know. Sure, if that's what you want." But to me that is ridiculous. Like lots of, you know, ice and green powders, and like, there's — sure, sure, if that stuff makes you feel good. But there was like not a moment in there about none of it felt meaningful. I was like, God, this is just skincare, cellular regeneration, and biohacking gone awry. So tedious.
[00:06:55] Henry Emmons, MD: Yeah. Yeah. We can wrap our lives around that too.
[00:06:59] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Absolutely. It can be a really great distraction.
[00:07:03] Henry Emmons, MD: Very true.
[00:07:04] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Mm-hmm. So I think focusing on this area of Resilience, cultivating a good heart, opening up, can actually be one of the fastest strategies to boost wellbeing. It will not take you from 4:30 to 6:50 every morning.
[00:07:18] Henry Emmons, MD: It's a huge shortcut.
[00:07:20] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Yeah, I love shortcuts. I got kicked out of a triathlon for taking a shortcut. I think I've told that story before. Hahaha.
[00:07:29] Henry Emmons, MD: You may love shortcuts a little too much. Hahaha.
[00:07:33] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Too much. I do regret that shortcut. It was like a joke triathlon. It was a joke. I was cheating. I was on like a golf cart. Anyway, I still have some guilt about it, I think. People were mad, shouldn't have done it. It was a bad idea.
This is a good shortcut. This is like — everybody can do this shortcut. And I love this as well, opening up the heart, cultivating a good heart. It's age-old wisdom. I was studying with some Traditional Tibetan Medicine Doctors in India many years ago, and they explained how they believe some sensory information runs through the heart first and then to the brain. This is a fairly common interpretation in a lot of indigenous and traditional healing practices, this kind of pathway. The assumption of more conventional or western medical systems though, at least for the last 100 years, has been that we gather sensory information like vision, taste, touch, smell, hearing, and it runs through the brain first, and then the orders are called out from there. But research is now finding that the heart isn't just a pump that follows the brain's commands. This is part of a growing field of — a scientific field called neurocardiology. And one of the key findings that really exploded this area of research is that the heart has a complex neural network, often called the heart-brain. And so it's very possible that some sensory information does kind of pass through the heart before the brain, just like many of our ancestors believed. Related — in the last 40 or so years, we have learned that the heart produces hormones. Things like atrial peptide, which has a role in stress hormones, and possibly motivation and behavior. The heart produces neurotransmitters like norepinephrine, epinephrine, dopamine, oxytocin. And oxytocin has been coined the "love hormone" because it's involved in a lot of bonding activities and cognition. The fact that the heart can produce it is like poetic.
The field of neurocardiology is also shining a light on our vagal nerves, so the main nerves of our parasympathetic nervous system, which is our nervous system associated with the relaxation response. And most of those fibers of the vagal nerves take information from the heart to the brain. So in this case of the vagal nerves, the heart tells the brain what to do more than the brain tells the heart what to do.
All of this to say, the heart isn't just responding to the world, it's actively shaping how we experience the world. And that means we have more leverage here than we think. And it also, I think, is evidence that we do need to tend to it.
[00:10:29] Henry Emmons, MD: Mm.
[00:10:30] Aimee Prasek, PhD: It's worth our time.
[00:10:31] Henry Emmons, MD: Mm-hmm. I really love that idea that some information passes through the heart first. I think that's so cool.
[00:10:39] Aimee Prasek, PhD: I thought it makes sense, like for how illogical — even though there's this idea of the heart-brain, still — seems like, oh, if it's passing through the heart and there's so much more depth, and feelings maybe, sitting in that space, that it's gathering something different as it goes to the brain, than the other way around.
[00:11:00] Henry Emmons, MD: I can almost imagine it like a filter that gives the brain a different way to process things.
[00:11:06] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Yeah. A different way to process things.
[00:11:08] Henry Emmons, MD: Yeah. Yeah. And I think, like you were saying, that more traditional cultures and traditional forms of medicine probably just saw this as a no-brainer. You know, this is... this the nature of things. So they didn't separate heart and mind in their thinking the way that we do.
[00:11:33] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Right.
[00:11:34] Henry Emmons, MD: Yeah. And it's so interesting how the cardiologists and scientists who work with the heart are the ones who kind of brought this connection out in western medicine.
[00:11:44] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Mm-hmm.
[00:11:45] Henry Emmons, MD: And yet I think that we kind of know this intuitively, don't we?
You know, when we are living as we are — as I think we're meant to be. When we feel 100% ourselves, this mind-heart-gut connection — beause it does involve the gut too — I think it just happens naturally. There's no real separation here. They communicate as one in real time. So until something happens that blocks this flow of energy and information, like unresolved grief maybe, or trauma, or feeling hurt, or excluded, or isolated, or alone. I mean, these are the things that I think block this naturally occurring flow. But I think that's happening mostly in the heart or this heart center, and I think we can release them by learning to let go of what we can, and learning how to allow ourselves to open up again. Again and again.
[00:12:54] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Yeah, the idea of blockages I love, because it also feels, like, real to me, tangible. I can do something physical as well to kind of move it along, which I think takes some of the burden off the brain. That matters because I think a lot of us would agree that thinking our way out of depression, or anxiety, or a panic attack, for example, is pretty impossible. I've tried that. It doesn't work, for me at least. I'm sure others would agree. Instead, we've got this whole system beyond the brain, or that includes the brain, that wants us — that helps us to regain our balance, our resilience. So we can work with the brain and mind, and we've got a gut that can be fed well to help our mood, and we've got energy that we can manage, and we've got a heart that can be opened through practices that are instinctual to us, but that we maybe just need to reconnect with.
So let's talk about some of those practices to do this. Henry, you've identified three practices in your books. They are self-acceptance, loving-kindness, and compassion. So let's kind of breeze over these a bit, knowing that we hit them deeply in our other Elements of Joy here at Joy Lab. And Henry, maybe you can then describe them specifically as it relates to cultivating a good heart.
[00:14:24] Henry Emmons, MD: Yeah, and you're right, hahaha, we have to breeze through them 'cause each of these is a really big topic. One — really you could fruitfully spend the rest of your life focusing on any one of them. But you know, that's the beauty of being holistic. If you do anything to help one part of yourself, it helps all of you.
Yeah, so self-acceptance. I think that this might be more important today than ever. 'Cause I see so much self-judgment, or outright disliking of oneself. And self-acceptance is a continuous practice. It's something that we can do every single day, throughout the day. 'Cause there are so many things that trigger this belief that we are somehow not good enough, we're somehow not okay as we are. And I think that this practice offers us the opportunity too, to be continually working at mindfulness. 'Cause you can be attentive to your emotions at any time throughout the day, and to the thoughts that trigger those emotions, and to your desire, and your efforts, to release your judgments. It's happening all the time. So if we're working with this, in a sense, we are practicing these skills all the time. And it, in doing so, it strengthens the good open heart that we're all aiming for.
Now, if anyone has taken a mindfulness class, you probably have learned to do this second practice that you mentioned, Aimee, the Loving-Kindness meditation. And if you were to do just one thing for your self-care, for your good , this would be a really powerful one. 'Cause it really helps to soften and open your heart, and it's something you could just do your whole life and keep growing from it. And some people do. That is their practice.
Now, it does help with this practice to have a little meditation training, mainly just so that you can calm and focus your mind. But this is really heart-based, I think, more than mind-based. And I think it really expands on a traditional mindfulness practice by placing your awareness on this heart-center, this energetic heart. And then it involves a really simple, beautiful practice of bringing various people to mind, just picturing them, holding an image of them. And then holding them in your heart and offering a silent blessing of some sort. Like, "may you be at peace," or "may you be happy," or "may you be filled with Loving-Kindness." And it just makes use of the spiritual truth that whatever you are giving to someone else, you are also receiving for yourself.
The third practice you mentioned, compassion practice, is really quite similar to this Loving-Kindness. In this case, you focus your awareness on the heart-center and bring others to mind, like you did before, sitting there with an open heart. And the focus is just a little bit different 'cause it's more — there's more awareness, I think, that this person you're holding in your awareness is suffering in some way or another. And then just holding them, you can offer a sense of compassion. Wishing for their healing, wishing for their release from suffering. And it's just a great way of acknowledging that we are all in this together. None of us is exempt from hardship or suffering. And I think that opens us up to a deeper sense of connection with — not just with our close friends and family, but with all of humanity.
[00:18:40] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Deep connection with all of humanity. Yeah. This is that unconditional connection that really is a superpower, that we can all tap into. So there's a practice that touches on all of these: self-acceptance, Loving-Kindness, compassion, that you covered in your book, Henry, _Chemistry of Calm_, you called it "The Three Kindnesses."
We do something like this in Joy Lab, in the Program, so maybe you might be familiar with it, but we wanna share it here now because it's super easy; it's super helpful; it's a transportable practice you can do anywhere, anytime, which is the point. To cultivate a more open and connected heart, anywhere, anytime.
So, do you wanna kind of guide us through this practice quickly, or explain it, Henry?
[00:19:30] Henry Emmons, MD: Yeah, sure. And I love this too, Aimee, in part because I think of kindness as the manifestation of this "cultivating a good heart" that we're talking about.
[00:19:43] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Hmm.
[00:19:45] Henry Emmons, MD: So this is pretty similar to the compassion practice we just talked about, but the focus is on kindness. And I think these two things are kind of mirror images of each other. If you really believe in compassion, then, I think, the only authentic response to other people is kindness.
So briefly, here's how you can do this, this really simple and beautiful practice. The essence is simply to notice acts of kindness when they occur around you. And they are happening. They're happening all the time. It's just that we often don't notice them. Simply noticing them is a really great antidote to the negativity, and even the hostility, that is also out there. So there are three different patterns of kindness that we are suggesting you look for and notice.
The first is when you see someone acting kindly to another person. So you might be just, I don't know, in the store and you see a mother soothing her child. Or someone letting a person go ahead of them. Or, you know, just being nice to the waitstaff — simply being nice to the wait staff at a restaurant, or somebody who's clearly having a rough day.
That's one. Notice when someone's doing something kind to another.
The second pattern is to notice when someone is acting kindly toward you. And again, this can be really small, no big deal. It can be what we call "micro-kindnesses," and they are noteworthy even if they're not a big deal. So just try to notice when someone treats you, in any small way, with kindness. And when they do, see if you can notice: does it change your inner experience in that moment? And how? You don't have to do anything about it, just noticing it will be enough.
And then finally, the third pattern is to become aware of when you act kindly toward someone else. This gets really interesting because as you notice this, you also start to change. I believe that you will find yourself being kind more often, which is a very good thing for you and the other people in your life.
[00:22:31] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Yeah, I'm thinking of two things right now. I'm going back to those Instagram, TikTok, morning routines and how focused, or how, like, how much time those folks are spending on — essentially, decreasing inflammation is like the driver in a lot of that stuff. You wanna know what can decrease inflammation so quickly?
It's kindness.
[00:22:54] Henry Emmons, MD: Mm-hmm.
[00:22:55] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Truly feel it in your body. And you don't have to jump into a bucket of ice. it's so much better. Anyway. And then the other thing I'm thinking of as you're going through this — I just had this memory, Henry, and this actually comes back to me a lot when I think about kindness, or when I do practices like this it pops into my head.
When I was in kindergarten, riding the bus, getting dropped off — and we lived on this busy road — and so I'd get dropped off, and I'd have to cross the road — and it was kind of scary, and I was kind of a wild kid anyway — so I would, like, get into a sprinter stance, but I had a humongous backpack — and so I'm ready to bolt across, and I bolt across the road, and I wiped out bad. Like, ate the pavement, laying on the middle of a busy road. And I got so scared, and so I got up really fast and ran to my house without my shoe — I lost a shoe in the fall. And by the time I got, you know, inside the door and told my mom, I was just crying, I had scrapes all over the front of me — somebody who saw that, picked up my shoe, parked their car, and walked my shoe back to me. I mean, this was 36 years ago, 37, 38 years ago.
[00:24:26] Henry Emmons, MD: Hahaha. Aww. That's pretty sweet.
[00:24:27] Aimee Prasek, PhD: I can still see him and the brown, like, shoe or sandal thing I was wearing. And I know everybody who saw that, saw him do that — I remember him, [so does] my mom. what a simple, small act of kindness that has influenced me throughout my life.
[00:24:47] Henry Emmons, MD: That's really cool. Yeah.
[00:24:50] Aimee Prasek, PhD: Isn't that sweet?
So look for the small stuff and do the small stuff. 'Cause I tell you, even if it's picking up a stranger's shoe, it can make a difference. So here is the power of our heart at work. And the truth, I think, that we noted a few episodes ago as well, with our thoughts, we make the world — with our heart, we make the world. So we can create something different. It's absolutely true I think, that we all wanna live in a kind world. So as we open up our heart and lead with these acts of kindness, and look for them, it will be created.
So to close our time today, I wanna share some wisdom from the 14th Dalai Lama. A pioneer, I think, in neurocardiology, actually. So here it is.
"This is my simple religion. There is no need for temples; no need for complicated philosophy. Our own brain, our own heart is our temple;
the philosophy is kindness."
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